What Did Putin Say to the Western World in His Interview with Tucker Carlson? Why was Turkey, Turks and even President Erdogan not mentioned in the interview?
In the interview, Putin scripted a revisionist history film about the collapse of the Soviet Union and NATO expansionism, including the 'Putin facts' about the creation of Russia and Ukraine.
Russian President Vladimir Putin gave a two-hour interview to former Fox News anchor Tucker Carlson. In the interview, Putin clearly presented his point of view on many issues, but in the end, no matter what Carlson asked him, he ultimately said, "Why is Ukraine Russian territory? Why did Russia have to carry out a special operation (in fact an attempted invasion) in Ukraine?" He has thus scripted a revisionist history film about the dissolution of the Soviet Union and NATO expansionism, not to mention the 'Putin facts' about the creation of Russia and Ukraine.
From the war in Ukraine to relations with the United States, from why jailed American reporter Evan Gershkovich was not released to the future of artificial intelligence, Putin gave the world his views on almost everything. Meanwhile, the fact that he said that Washington, which is behind Ukraine, should be willing to reach an agreement with Russia to end the war should be seen as a sign that he still does not see Ukrainian President Zelensky as an interlocutor. Meanwhile, Biden asked his Administration, "Should you fight in Ukraine? Wouldn't it be better to negotiate with Russia?", giving the image of Putin, who actually desires a dignified peace, was remarkable.
By the way, it was amusing to watch the famous anchor Tucker sometimes grimace with disbelief during the interview, like Harrison Ford in Star Wars.
One of the things the Western world was curious about was what Putin had to say about the possibility of a Russian attack through the Suwalki Pass. Putin made it clear in the interview that he was more interested in improving relations with the West than in retaking the Baltic states of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia. He made it clear that he had no intention of attacking Poland or Latvia. However, I think it is important to remember that Putin said that he was not interested in attacking Ukraine 3 days before Russia attacked Ukraine.
In the interview, Putin did not mention Turkey, Erdogan, the Ottomans, the Golden Horde Khanate, the Crimean Khanate, etc. It was thought-provoking that Putin, who presented a very detailed history of Russia's formation dating back to the 9th century, did not feel the need to mention Russia's 1,000-year-old neighbor, the Turks. Either for Moscow, there really was no problem in relations with Ankara, or Putin only had the Western world, the US and NATO in his crosshairs. Apparently, Turkey remained outside his periphery.
I consider this important interview important in terms of understanding the 'spirit' of the relations between Russia and the Western World in the context of the Kremlin, with the Russia-Ukraine War at the center. I present the transcript of the interview to your attention to be read every now and then when we ask 'what Putin wants to do'.
What does Putin want to do?
Tucker Carlson: "In your speech before the Ukraine war, you said that the US could attack Russia through NATO. How did you come to this conclusion?"
Vladimir Putin: "That's not what I said. Is this a talk show or an interview? Let me give you a 30-second or one-minute history lesson. Let's look at how our relationship with Ukraine started. Where Ukraine came from. The Russian state started to gather as a centralized state. The foundation of the Russian state dates back to 826. The people of Novgorod invited Rurik, a Varegian prince, to lead them. In 1826, Russia celebrated 1000 years of statehood. There is a monument to this in Novgorod.
In 882 Oleg, Rurik's successor, arrived in Kiev. He deposed the two brothers who had been subordinate to Rurik and Russia began to develop with two centers of power, Novgorod and Kiev. The next important date in Russian history is 998. Russia was baptized and accepted Orthodoxy. The centralized Russian state began to grow stronger because it had territorial unity, economic relations, the same language, the same faith, and the rule of the prince. In the Middle Ages, Prince Yaroslav introduced the succession of the throne from father to son, and then when he died, things got complicated, the throne was passed through different lineages, which led to divisions and the end of Russia as a single state. This was also happening in Europe, but the fragmented Russian state was easy prey for Genghis Khan, and his successor Batuhan came to the Russian lands and plundered and destroyed all the cities.
Kiev and other southern cities lost their independence, but the northern states partially retained their sovereignty. Then the Russian state centered in Moscow began to form. The southern lands, namely Kiev, were being pulled towards the center that was forming in Europe. Russians were a very large part of this society. Then, through alliances, some Orthodox priests came under the authority of the Pope, and these lands became part of the Polish-Lithuanian state. For decades the Poles Polonized these lands, tried to impose that these people were not Russians, they said they were Ukrainians. Ukrainians meant those who lived on the edges of the Polish-Lithuanian state, those who patrolled, it was not an ethnic group. These parts of the Russian lands were Polonized, they treated those people harshly, even brutally, letters were written to Warsaw asking for their rights to be respected. This happened in the 13th century.
When the rulers of the Russian lands did not answer their calls, they turned their faces to Moscow. And lest you think I am making it up, let me give you these documents, archival documents. The leaders there asked the Russian tsar to protect the people there. Part of the Russian territory was annexed to the Tsardom, war broke out with Poland, an armistice was signed in 1654. 32 years later, in a peace treaty, the entire left bank of the Dnieper - including Kiev - was given to Russia, the right bank remained in Poland.
Under the leadership of Catherine the Great, Russia regained all its historical territories. Before the First World War, the Austrian General Staff actively promoted the idea of Ukrainization. Their intentions were clear, they wanted to create favorable conditions for themselves on the border line before the war and weaken the potential enemy. In other words, the Austrian General Staff was propagandizing the idea that the people in that part of Poland were not really Russian, but had a different ethnic identity. In the 19th century there were theoreticians who talked about Ukrainian independence. After the 1917 revolution, the Bolsheviks wanted to restore the structure of the state and civil war broke out, war with Poland broke out. In 1921 peace was signed, the right bank of the Dnieper was again given to Poland. In 1939 Poland cooperated with Hitler, Hitler offered a treaty of friendship, he wanted Poland to give the Germans the Danzig corridor, they refused, they still cooperated with Hitler, together they tried to partition Czechoslovakia."
Tucker Carlson: "If parts of Ukraine are part of Russian territory, why didn't you go in and take them when you became president, why did you wait so long, you have nuclear weapons, they don't."
Vladimir Putin: "I will come there, this history briefing is almost over. Before the Second World War, Poland did not accept Hitler's demands, but nevertheless cooperated with Hitler, supported the partition of Czechoslovakia. Because Poland would not compromise, Hitler had no choice but to implement his plans for Poland in 1939. Meanwhile, the Soviets were very honest and asked Poland for permission to send troops through Polish territory in support of Czechoslovakia. But the Polish Foreign Minister said that if Russian planes flew over Polish territory they would be shot down. But the important thing is that the war started and Poland became the prey of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact and its attempts against Czechoslovakia. The western Ukraine was to be given to Russia, Russia, the Soviets, reclaimed their historical territory.
After the victory in the Second World War, those territories were recognized as Russian territory. Poland, on the other hand, received as reparations the territory formerly belonging to Germany, the eastern part of Germany is now the western part of Poland. In 1922, when the Soviets were formed, the Bolsheviks created Soviet Ukraine, which did not exist before. Stalin insisted that these territories should be autonomously part of the Soviets.
Lenin, for some reason, wanted those territories to be withdrawn from the Soviets, and he also transferred the previously non-Ukrainian territories with their peoples to those autonomous regions. This included the Black Sea coast, which had no historical ties with Ukraine. When Russia captured them as a result of the Russo-Turkish wars, they were called New Russia, but in the end, this is how Lenin created Ukraine. Soviet Ukraine developed as part of the Soviets.
Again, for some reason, the Bolsheviks embarked on a policy of Ukrainization, a general Soviet move of indigenization, which was also done in other Soviet autonomous territories, supporting national cultures and languages, which is not a bad thing. After the war Ukraine was also given the territories of Hungary and Romania, Soviet Ukraine was given these territories, and Ukraine still has these territories. So Ukraine is an artificial state that was shaped according to Stalin's will."
Tucker Carlson: "Then Hungary and other countries have the right to take back their territories in Ukraine, to return to the borders of 1654?"
Vladimir Putin: "I'm not sure if they should do that. But if you look at the period of the so-called Stalin regime, when, according to many people, there were countless violations of human rights, violations of other people's rights, you can say that they may not have the right, but they could do it, it would be understandable. But I know that Hungarians living there want to return to their historical lands.
In the early 1980s, when I was traveling across the Soviet Union, I went to a town called Berehove in western Ukraine, where all the signs were in Russian and Hungarian, not Ukrainian. The men sitting in front of the houses had black clothes and black top hats. I asked if they were some kind of entertainers and they said they were Hungarian. When I asked what they were doing then, they said, 'What do you mean, this land is theirs'. I know that this long talk of mine is a bit out of the interview style, but that's why I asked at the beginning, are we going to have a conversation or a serious talk? And you said we are going to have a serious talk.
Soviet Ukraine was created, the Soviets collapsed in 1991, everything that Russia generously gave to Ukraine was taken away by Ukraine. I am coming to a very important point, the collapse of the Soviet Union was initiated by the Russian leaders, I don't know what they had in their minds at that time, but probably for many reasons they thought that everything would be fine. I think Russian leaders thought that the relationship between Ukraine and Russia is based on a common language, family ties, common culture, common history and religion, deeply interconnected economies. All these things make good relations inevitable. I want the American people to hear this.
Russian leaders had accepted the collapse of the Soviet Union and there were no more ideological divisions, and they hoped that this would be seen by the so-called civilized West as an invitation to cooperation, which is what Russia expected from the United States and the West. Whereas in Germany there were smart men like Egon Bahr, who in his talks with Russian leaders before the Soviet collapse said that Germany should be united, that there should be a new security order in Europe with the US, Canada and Russia, but that NATO should not expand. Because he said that if NATO expanded, everything would be just like in the Cold War, except that it would happen on the Russian borders. He was a wise old man, but nobody listened, and he even got angry and said, 'If you don't listen to me, I will never set foot in Moscow again."
Tucker Carlson: "You've never explained why relations are actually bad, except to say that the West is afraid of a strong Russia. After all, there is a strong China and the West doesn't seem to be very afraid of it. Why do you think Western policymakers felt that they had to dismantle Russia?"
Vladimir Putin: "The West is more afraid of a strong China. Because Russia has 150 million inhabitants, China has 1.5 billion, and its economy is growing by leaps and bounds. As Bismarck said, it's all about potential. China's potential is very high, it has already surpassed the US and is growing rapidly. But let's not talk about who is afraid of whom. Instead, let's look at this, after 1991 Russia thought that it would be accepted into the fraternal family of civilized states, but it didn't happen, we were deceived. The US said that NATO would not expand, but it expanded 5 times, we tolerated all of them, we tried to convince them, we said, 'Please don't do it', we said, 'We are bourgeois like you, we have a free market, there is no communism, let's negotiate'.
Yeltsin went to the Congress and said 'God bless the USA', it was all a signal, 'let us be among you'. When things started happening in Yugoslavia, we raised our voice in defense of the Serbs, of course there were complicated processes, but we had to support, Serbs are a nation close to us, they have an Orthodox culture. Yeltsin just expressed his support. And what did the US do? It bombed Belgrade in violation of UN rules, in violation of international law.
It was the US that let the genie out of the bottle. What was said when Russia protested? Suddenly UN rules and international law became irrelevant. Now everyone talks about international law, but back then everyone wanted everything to change, they said it was old. They immediately threw mud at Yeltsin, called him an alcoholic, said he didn't understand anything. But he understood everything.
In 2000, I became President, I said okay, the Yugoslavia issue is over, I thought we should improve relations with the West, let's open the door that Russia was trying to pass through. I met with President Clinton in the Kremlin, I even said, 'Bill, do you think it would be OK if we wanted to join NATO' and he said, 'I think it would be OK, it would be interesting'. Then we sat down for dinner and what did he say? He said, 'You know what, I talked to my team, it's not possible right now. You can go and ask him, he will confirm it.
If they had said yes, the rapprochement process would have started and we could have finally entered NATO, if we had seen sincerity, but it didn't happen. No means no, okay. We realized they didn't want us, so we said let's build relations in different ways, let's try at different levels.
Tucker Carlson: "Why do you think they didn't want to let you into NATO, what was the reason?"
Vladimir Putin: "Russia was a big country with its own ideas. I know how things are done in NATO, I will give you an example with Ukraine. The US leader puts pressure and all NATO members give in and vote, even if they don't like something. We tried to establish relations on different levels, we were establishing little by little relations with the US during the Iraq issue, I said that the US should not support separatism or terrorism in the Caucasus, but they still continued. Political, intelligence, financial and even military support.
I brought this up to my counterpart and he said, 'This is impossible, do you have evidence?' When I gave him the evidence, he looked at it and you know what he said? He said, 'I'm going to kick their asses'. We waited and waited, nothing happened, there was no answer. I asked the FSB Director to write a message to the CIA, we asked for the result. We wrote twice and got an answer. It's in the archives. 'We are working with the opposition in Russia, we believe this is the right thing to do and we will continue to do it'. Laughable.
The next important point, the establishment of the US missile defense system, the beginning of everything, we tried to persuade the US not to do it alone. I had a serious meeting with Bush Sr. and his team. I suggested that the US, Europe and Russia should build a joint defense system, we thought it was a threat to our security if done alone, even though the US said it was against Iran. I said let's work together, they said it was interesting and asked if we were serious. I said we could seriously change the situation in the world by making a global effort for such a security challenge.
The US Secretary of Defense came and said, 'We are participating,' but then they put conditions. At the end they told us, 'Get lost'. Then I said, 'Look, then we will have to take countermeasures, we will build attack systems that can overcome defense systems. We have produced and continue to produce intercontinental hypersonic systems, and we are ahead of the US.
They said that NATO would not expand even an inch to the east, then they said, 'After all, this is not something agreed on paper', and there have been five waves of expansion. Now they have come to Ukraine. In 2008, they declared that NATO's doors were open to Georgia and Ukraine. How are the decisions made? Germany, France and a few other European countries were against it, but then Bush - a very tough guy - put pressure and forced it. It's ridiculous, like kindergarten. Where are the guarantees? What kind of people are they?
And then they say 'Ukraine will not be in NATO'. How should I know? You accepted it in 2008, why not in the future? They say there was pressure then. Why shouldn't they put pressure in the future, they will do it again? You will accept it again. Who should I talk to now? In 2008, they opened the doors of NATO to Ukraine. Is this how we agreed?
When Yanukovich took office in Ukraine, the opposition did not accept the result, and a third round was organized under US pressure. This is not in the constitution. What is this? This is a coup. Imagine if someone in the US didn't like the results and a third round was organized? Yushtshenko came into office, he was pro-Western, but that's okay, we improved relations with him. Things started to get worse because of Leonid Kutschma's leadership, and finally Yanukovich came into office. Then there was the issue of the association agreement with the EU. OK, we said, 'Suit yourself', but when we read the agreement we realized that it was a problem for us.
We had a free trade zone with Ukraine, but with this agreement this zone had to open its borders to Europe, which would cause a flood to our market. So we said, 'No, this cannot happen'. Yanukovich thought about what Ukraine had to gain and what Ukraine had to lose and said to the Europeans, 'I need more time to think before signing'. As soon as he said that, the opposition started to take destructive steps and it went all the way to the Maidan demonstrations and the coup.
The US said to us, 'Calm Yanukovich down and we will calm down the opposition and there will be a political solution'. Yanukovich neither used the army nor took up arms, but the armed opposition staged a coup in Kiev. I wanted to say to the US leaders at the time, 'Who do you think you are? The coup was of course supported by the CIA. They managed to change the government. But politically it was a mistake. They should have realized where this was going. They persecuted those who did not accept the coup, they started threatening Crimea and we had to take it under our protection. In 2014 they started a war against civilians with airplanes and howitzers.
This is how it all started, there are images of airplanes bombing civilians. How could we not be concerned? We could not remain indifferent. The US pushed us to this point. Indifference could have ruined Russia. And we could not leave our brothers in religion, the Russians, at the mercy of this war machine."
Tucker Carlson: "What was the moment, what was the trigger that made you think you had to intervene in Ukraine?
Vladimir Putin: "It was the coup in Ukraine that started the conflict. The guarantors of the agreement between the Yanukovich government and the opposition were representatives of Germany, France and Poland. Nevertheless, the opposition staged a coup d'état and all these countries acted as if they did not remember that they were guarantors of a peaceful settlement. They supported the coup instead of bringing the issue to the political arena. Yanukovich had agreed to all the conditions, he had even agreed to early elections which he had no chance of winning. Then why was there a coup, why were lives lost, why was Crimea threatened, why was the operation launched in Donbass? I don't understand this.
The CIA fulfilled its mission to complete the coup. But the political mistake was huge. They could have done all this legally, without victims, without military actions, without losing Crimea. We wouldn't have lifted a finger without the bloody developments on the Square, because we accepted the borders when the Soviets collapsed.
But we did not accept NATO's expansion and Ukraine's entry into NATO. We didn't want NATO to set up bases there without asking us. For decades we went around pleading, 'Don't do this, don't do that'.
So what started the current conflict? First of all, the current Ukrainian leadership declared that it would not implement the Minsk agreements. A year and a half ago, the former leaders of Germany and France announced publicly that they had signed the Minsk agreements, but they never intended to implement them. They have us wrapped around their finger. We talked about it all the time, we called on the United States, we asked for its implementation.
Yes, it was problematic for Ukraine, there were elements of independence for Donbass, but we could have persuaded the people of Donbass to return to Ukraine, we could have worked hard, the wounds would have healed over time. But no, everyone wanted to settle the issue only with military force. And we couldn't allow that to happen. The Ukrainian side started preparing for military actions. They are the ones who started the war in 2014. Our goal is to end this war. We didn't start this war in 2022, this is an attempt to end the war."
Tucker Carlson: "And have you been able to end the war, have you achieved your goals?"
Vladimir Putin: "No, we haven't achieved our goals yet, because one of the goals is denazification, the banning of all kinds of neo-Nazi movements. This was one of the issues we discussed in the talks that ended in Istanbul. Germany and France told us 'how can they sign an agreement if you put a gun to their heads', so we withdrew our troops from Kiev. As soon as we withdrew, the rulers in Kiev threw away all the agreements we had reached in Istanbul. Then they prepared for a long armed war with the support of the US and the satellite states in Europe. This is how it developed and this is the situation now.
Denazification is an important issue. When Ukraine gained its independence, it started looking for its identity, and it had no better idea than to base it on false heroes who collaborated with Hitler. In the Second World War, the ultra-nationalist elite collaborated with Hitler, they thought it would bring freedom. Hitler had his Ukrainian collaborators do the dirtiest work, Poles, Jews, Russians were exterminated. Names like Bandera were made national heroes, that's the problem.
Don't neo-Nazi ideologies exist in other countries? Yes. But those countries are fighting against it. Ukraine doesn't have that. They make statues of those people, they carry their flags, they march with torches and shout their names like in Nazi Germany. I say Ukrainians are part of the Russian people, they say they are not. Well... If they see themselves as a separate ethnic identity, that's fine, but they cannot base it on Nazi ideology.
The President of Ukraine visited Canada, they introduced a man in the parliament, they said he fought against the Russians in the Second World War. Well, who fought against the Russians at that time? Hitler and his supporters. It turned out that this man was a member of the SS, those who killed Russians, Jews and Poles. The leader of Ukraine stood up and applauded him along with everyone else. How can this be?
Hitler may be dead, but his idea is alive. Those who destroyed Russians, Jews and Poles are alive, and the President of Ukraine is applauding them. How can we then say that we have destroyed this ideology? We must get rid of those who support this concept and try to keep it alive. This is denazification."
Tucker Carlson: "But you don't control all of Ukraine. How do you destroy a certain worldview or ideology without controlling that country? Why haven't there been talks to end the war?"
Vladimir Putin: "During the Istanbul talks we agreed, in writing, that neo-Nazi ideology would not be nurtured in Ukraine. It would be banned under the law. There were talks, they reached a very high level. They were almost concluded, but as soon as we withdrew from Kiev, the other side violated the agreements and followed the instructions of the Western countries. The Ukrainian leader signed a bill banning talks with Russia. But how can we negotiate if they forbid it? We know he has some ideas, but we have to have a dialog to decide anything."
Tucker Carlson: "When was the last time you spoke to Biden? This could escalate into a global war, even a nuclear issue. Why don't you call Biden and get it done?"
Vladimir Putin: "I don't remember the last time I spoke with Biden. Do I have to remember? I have my own affairs, domestic politics. The last time we spoke was before the special military operation, I didn't tell him that he made a mistake of historic proportions. Go and ask him about his answer. What is there to settle anyway? We communicate through some channels. If they want the war to end, they should stop sending weapons. In a few weeks the war will stop. Then we can make a deal. Why should I call? What should I talk about? Should I beg him? What am I going to say? 'You're giving such and such weapons to Ukraine, I'm scared, don't do it'? What do I have to talk to him about?
NATO is trying to scare its own people with an imaginary Russian threat. There is only one scenario in which I would have to send Russian troops to Poland, and that is if Poland attacks us. We have no claim on Poland or Lithuania. Why would we do it? This is absolutely, absolutely out of the question. You don't need to be an analyst for that. There is nothing smart about getting involved in a global war. A global war would bring all of humanity to the brink of extinction.
Of course, from the beginning they have been scaring people with us: 'Russia will use tactical nuclear weapons tomorrow, it will use this, it will use that, it will use the next day'. Why? They want to collect more taxes from Americans and Europeans for the war in Ukraine. The goal is to weaken Russia as much as possible."
Tucker Carlson: "US Senator Chuck Schumer said that we need to continue to fund Ukraine's efforts, otherwise US citizens or US troops might get involved, might have to fight. What do you want to say?"
Vladimir Putin: "This is a provocation, a cheap provocation. Why should US soldiers fight in Ukraine? There are mercenaries from the US, most of the mercenaries come from Poland, they also come from Georgia. If someone has the intention to send regular troops, it will bring the world to the brink of a serious global war. Does the US want this? Why? This is thousands of kilometers away from your territory. Don't you have anything else to do? You have problems with your borders, with immigration, with the national debt, you have a debt of more than 33 trillion dollars. Don't you have anything else to do but fight in Ukraine?
Isn't it better to negotiate and make a deal with Russia and understand that Russia will fight to the end for its interests? Isn't it better to act rationally, respect our country and its interests and look for some solutions? That seems smarter.
Tucker Carlson: "Who blew up the Nord Stream pipeline? Do you have evidence that NATO or the CIA did it?"
Vladimir Putin: "Definitely you did it. The CIA has no such excuse. I won't go into details, but in such situations they always say, 'Look at who has a vested interest'. In this case, we should look not only for someone who has a vested interest, but also for someone who has the capability. Because there are many parties with interests, but not all of them have the ability to go to the bottom of the Baltic Sea and create an explosion. You need to bring the two together."
Tucker Carlson: "The blowing up of the Nord Stream pipeline has taken a heavy toll on the German economy, damage that may never heal. Why is Germany silent about the fact that NATO partners did it?"
Vladimir Putin: "This puzzles me too. But the German leaders of this period are acting in the interests of the collective West rather than their own national interests. Otherwise, it is difficult to explain the logic of their actions or inactions. After all, this is not only about the Nord Stream boom, there is a line through which we can deliver gas to Europe, but the Germans won't open it. Whereas we are ready.
There is another line through Poland to Germany, but Poland has closed it. However, Germany is feeding Poland through funds such as the Pan-European Fund, and Germany pays the most money to these funds. And Poland is closing the lines to Germany. Why? Then Ukraine. The Germans give arms and money to Ukraine. Germany is the number two sponsor of the US in terms of financial aid to Ukraine. There are two gas lines going through Ukraine, but the Ukrainians shut them down.
Why don't the Germans say, 'Look, we are giving you money and weapons, please open the lines and let the gas from Russia reach us'? Why don't they say, 'We are buying liquefied gas in Europe at exorbitant prices, which makes our economy uncompetitive, if you want us to give you money, let our economy make money, because that's where what we give you comes from'? Go and ask them. (Banging on the table) That's what's in their heads. They are very incompetent men."
Tucker Carlson: "How have US sanctions (on others) changed the role of the dollar in the world? Is the dollar losing its influence?"
Vladimir Putin: "Using the dollar as a foreign policy tool is one of the biggest strategic mistakes of US political leaders. For the US, the dollar is an important benchmark, no matter how many dollars are printed, they quickly spread around the world. The US dollar is the main tool for the US to maintain its global power.
The moment they made the decision to use the dollar as a political tool, this US power was dealt a serious blow. It's a stupid thing, a big mistake. Look what is happening in the world. Even US allies are reducing their dollar reserves, they see this and they are looking for a way to protect themselves.
The US sanctions on certain countries in the form of restrictions on transactions and asset freezes are sending a serious signal to the world. Until 2022, 80 percent of Russian foreign trade was conducted in US dollars and euros. Fifty percent of our transactions with third countries were in dollars.
Now this rate has dropped to 13 percent. We did not do this, we did not intend to do this, the decision to restrict our transactions in dollars came from the United States. It's a stupid thing for US interests, it hurts the US economy and limits US global power. Our transactions in Yuan were 3 percent, now 34 percent are in Rubles and a little more than that in Yuan.
Why did the US do this? I think it was arrogance, they thought it would cause Russia to collapse, but nothing collapsed. I wonder if anyone in the US realizes this? What are you doing, you are shooting your own foot."
Tucker Carlson: "Are you worried about BRICS being dominated by China?"
Vladimir Putin: These are always bogeyman stories, we hear the same stories again. We are neighbors with China, just like you can't choose close relatives, you can't choose your neighbor. We have thousands of kilometers of border with China, we have been side by side for centuries, we are used to it, China's foreign policy philosophy is not aggressive, it is always based on finding concessions, and we see this. Our relations with China are growing, but EU-China relations are growing faster than Russian-Chinese relations. Ask the Europeans, are they afraid? Maybe they are afraid, but they are trying to access the Chinese market at any cost. Chinese companies are exploring the European market. US politicians are trying to restrict relations with China, to the detriment of the US, you are hurting yourself.
Tucker Carlson: "If there is a new administration in the US after Biden, can relations with the US be restored? Or is it irrelevant who is president?"
Vladimir Putin: "It's not about a particular leader or his personality. For example, I had good relations with Bush, I think he made a lot of mistakes on Russia, but in general, as a human being, I had good relations with him, no worse than any other European, American or Russian politician I know.
I had this kind of relationship with Trump as well. It's not the personality of the leader, it's the mindset of the elites. As long as the idea of gaining the upper hand by force, no matter what the cost, is dominant in US society, nothing will change, it will only get worse. But if someone finally realizes that the world is changing and needs to adapt to it, then something might change. Russia was the number one economy in Europe last year, despite all the sanctions. Russia is the most sanctioned country in the world and yet we became the number one economy in Europe.
The tools the US is using are not working. If the ruling elites understand this, the head of state will act in this direction. Then things might change. It's hard to understand who makes the decisions, each state has its own system, someone can be excluded from the election, it's a difficult system."
Tucker Carlson: "Does Zelensky have the freedom to make deals/negotiations to end this war?"
Vladimir Putin: "He had this power. His father fought in the Second World War against the Nazis, against the fascists. I spoke to him once about this issue. I said, 'Volodymyr, what are you doing, why are you supporting neo-Nazis in Ukraine today when your father fought against fascism? As for freedom, he has freedom, why not. The Ukrainian people elected him believing that he will bring peace. He addressed this issue, that's why he was elected. But I think when he came into office he realized that it is better not to fight the neo-Nazis, because they are very aggressive and active, everything is expected from them.
He also realized that the West, led by the US, supports them and will always support those who are against Russia. So he took the necessary stance, contrary to his promises to the people, he deceived his voters. He is the president of the state, he won the elections. Although we in Russia believe that everything that happened after 2014 was caused by the coup d'état, so the government today is objectionable. But he considers himself the head of state and the US, Europe and the rest of the world recognize him.
We met with Ukraine in Istanbul, and even the leader of the Ukrainian negotiating delegation, Arakhamia, signed the preliminary agreement, but then he announced to the world that the then British Prime Minister Boris Johnson came and told him not to sign, that it was better to fight with Russia. Do they want to go back to this stage? They can, but do they want to? Let the Ukrainian leader cancel the bill banning talks with us, and that's it. We have never refused to meet, there is always talk about 'is Russia ready'. Yes, we did not refuse, it was they who refused. As Arakhamia said, we could have stopped these conflicts a year and a half ago, where is Johnson now? But the war continues."
Tucker Carlson: "When will the artificial intelligence empire begin?"
Vladimir Putin: "Humanity faces many threats. Thanks to genetic research, it is possible to create superhumans, special people, a genetically modified athlete, an artist, a soldier. There are reports that Elon Musk is implanting chips. There is no way to stop Elon Musk anyway. He will do whatever he wants. Still, we need to meet on a common ground and convince him, smart man, we need to agree, because this whole process should be bound by certain rules. Humanity has to consider what might happen because of genetic research or artificial intelligence. When humanity realized that nuclear weapons are an existential threat, all the nuclear powers started to agree with each other.
It is impossible to stop genetic research or artificial intelligence, just as it was once impossible to stop gunpowder. But the moment we realize there are threats from genetic research or artificial intelligence, it will be time for international agreements."
Tucker Carlson: "Can you give us Evan Gershkovich, the American journalist in Russian prison, as a gesture of goodwill? We'll take him back to the United States."
Vladimir Putin: "So far we have shown so many goodwill gestures, we have shown so many goodwill gestures that I think we don't have any more. Nobody has responded to us in the same way. In theory, of course, we can do it, but our partners should reciprocate/step in the same way. We want to deal with this issue, there are talks through the secret services, I think a deal can be reached.
There may be different views on what is spying and what is not, but there is also the law. If someone gets hold of classified information and does it in the form of a conspiracy, that is spying. That's exactly what he was doing, accessing classified information in a clandestine way. Maybe he did it out of carelessness or on his own initiative, but it's still spying. We were caught red-handed, it would have been different if it was something unproven. The secret services are in contact, let them do their job. We are ready to talk, talks are taking place, there is a possibility that Mr. Gershkovich will return home. We have had successful negotiations before and I am sure this one will be successful too. I want him to come home, I am sincere."
Tucker Carlson: "Is it humiliating for NATO at this stage to accept Russian domination over territory that belonged to Ukraine two years ago?"
Vladimir Putin: "Let them think, let them consider how they can do it while preserving their dignity. Where there is a will, there is a possibility. Until now there were shouts about the strategic defeat of Russia, and now it seems that they are beginning to realize that it is difficult, even impossible. In my opinion, it is impossible. It will never happen.
I think the leaders in the West also understand this. If they realize this, let them think about what they should do next. We are ready for dialogue. Relations between the two peoples (Russia-Ukraine) will be restored somehow, it will take time, but the wounds will heal.
Let me give you an example, a true story from the war, our soldiers surrounded Ukrainian soldiers, they told them 'Surrender, you have no chance, surrender and your life will be spared'. They responded in Russian saying 'Russians don't surrender' and they all died. They still see themselves as Russians. It is a kind of civil war. But there is still unity, they will be one again."
